Monday, October 12, 2015
So many adventures!
At long last we are officially in the thick of Odysseus and his adventures on the weird islands. Which of the unusual places that Odysseus and his men visit, which place and interaction with the inhabitants of that place do you think reveals important aspects of Odysseus' character. Essentially, how does his behavior in these different places help you understand more about his character? Please be sure to include evidence from the text to support your idea. You must include textual evidence to receive full credit for this blog.
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In the last blog, I spoke of Odysseus’ complexity as a character; he is not completely good or entirely bad. Different events in this chapter develop different parts of his character in the readers’ eyes. Prior to the encounter with the Laestrygonians (p. 233-234), Odysseus uses his strategic skills to recognize the danger of leaving his ship in the narrow inlet between the cliffs in a foreign land. Instead of warning the rest of his squadron, he keeps this to himself (“Here the rest of my rolling squadron steered […] but I alone anchored my black ship outside […]”). His ship is the only one that will be able to escape quickly in case of an emergency, and Odysseus knew this. While his intentions may not be entirely malicious, his narcissistic methods of survival indicate that he would pick himself over others. However, on Circe’s island (p. 242), Odysseus returns to Circe’s home; with Hermes’ potion as protection, but nevertheless; risks being turned into a pig for eternity to save his men instead of sailing away and writing them off as lost crew. He tells Circe, refusing the meal she offered him, that ““Circe – how could any man in his right mind endure the taste of food and drink before he’d freed his comrades-in-arms and looked them in the eyes?”” Odysseus demonstrates his darker side by choosing not to save his friends from the Laestrygonians and allowing anywhere from 300 to 450 men to perish, but he also chooses to head straight into the heart of the danger on Circe’s island to get his comrades back. We get a deeper view as readers into the complexity of Odysseus’ character, as opposed to a simple, straightforward explanation of his morals.
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ReplyDeleteAs Sarah said above, Odysseus is a complex character and cannot be classified as simply good or evil. I think he has layers of both. Of course, in the Trojan War he was a great hero, but in the journey home he seems to be greedy and unfaithful to his crewmembers. In the past few chapters, Odysseus has proved himself as disloyal, savage, and irresponsible. He has no regard for the safety of his crewmembers and has greedily left them behind to die on multiple occasions. His visits to the Island of Polyphemus, to Aeaea, and to the land of the Laestrygonians, revealed that he really doesn’t care if his shipmates live or die as long as he gets out alive. On the Island of Polyphemus, Odysseus allows countless men to die on his behalf and while he does get vengeance by blinding Polyphemus, he leaves many to die on the island as he sails away. Like it was mentioned in line 74, later when he returns to Aeaea looking for refuge, he blames the failure of his journey home on his “mutinous” crew and acknowledges no accountability of his even though he is the captain and should have his subordinates under control. Thirdly, Odysseus made a getaway on his own when he realized that the Laestrygonians were trying to kill him and his crew. He had moored his ship on the outward most spot in the port so he could get away quickly if necessary and instead of staying to fight for his men, he left on his own and allowed for 330 of his men to die. These three instances proved that Odysseus works on an “every man for himself” basis. Around line 144 in book 10, Odysseus mentions having had to leave his crew behind as a meal for the Laestrygonians and his ship alone was the only one to get out of the harbor unscathed. The story of his time on the Island of the Laestrygonians in particular revealed the most about Odysseus’ character and that the only person he was really looking out for is himself, doing whatever he needs to do, sacrificing whoever he needs to, in order to make it home alive.
ReplyDeleteSo far, Odysseus’s story has covered many strange destinations. There are welcome, hospitable inhabitants but there also are inhabitants gobbled them up at first sight. In my opinion, the unlucky situations were usually the situations that gave us the 3 dimensional look into Odysseus character. The first encounter that worth mentioning is at Laestrygonian land (pg 233, 234). Obviously, Odysseus, as an experienced person, was wary of the chance of citizens “not live on bread” and tied his ship outside instead of going into the cliff like the crew (line 100-106 pg 233). However, the place where I find hard to understand was why didn’t he encourage his crew to do the same thing, to stay outside? Clearly, it wouldn’t cause him any harm but even saved lives of his comrades. Therefore, his decision revealed somewhat the selfishness inside Odysseus and he didn’t really value the life of his comrades as much as what he self described when leaving his friends behind:” sick at heart for the dear companions we had lost.” (line 146,147 pg 234) Although, I personally think there is a motivation of his action, steaming from the previous journey. His shipmates jealousy has not only pushed them and Odysseus back to where they started, Aeolian island, but also delayed their journey home years afterward (line 39-87 page 231-233). It was also mentioned in the text that before the accident happened, Odysseus held the boat for himself, didn’t trust anyone enough to handle him the ropes (line 35-37, pg 231). Accordingly, he didn’t see his crews as friends to friends but more like a general to soldiers, no more than a tool to go home. This new side of Odysseus was developed further in the next destination- Aeaean Island. As stated in line 167-170 page 235, he wasn’t willing to discover this new island on his own at all, instead, he decided to feed his men and then make them go instead. Despite all the tears of scare and horror from the crews, he refused, claimed “what good can come of grief?. Later on, there was the paragraph describing Odysseus's intention to kill Eurylochus when he spoke out against him fault at Cyclops place (line 473-482 pg 244). This proved that Odysseus was quite a self absorber and irresponsible for his wrongdoing. Surprisingly, as Sarah mentioned, he later on was the only one in the remaining brave enough to go to Circe place to look for the missing men. Even though at first sight, this seemed to be a daring, respectful act to do, from what I discovered myself, his ship clearly could not function with nearly half the crew missing. So he was actually standing between two options, too die gradually on the coastline or to take the chance of retrieving the crew. He went alone indeed but the true was that the rest of his crew were clearly pushed to their limit after seeing Eurylochus reaction (line 269-275 pg 238). If he forced them any harder, they would probably went against him. Hence, from his adventures, we can draw conclusion that Odysseus is a independent working kind of man. He has a sharp, acute mind but definitely not for share because it only brings back the ultimate benefits to himself.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus is very complicated. He is a venerated leader who most people look up to. I agree with both Anna, Sarah and Huong, how Odysseus certainly cares more about his own benefits rather than the life of others. When Odysseus and his crew reached the Laestrygonian Island, he purposely anchored his ship away from the harbor to ensure his own safety. This is shown on page 233, “We entered a fine harbor there, all walled around by a great unbroken sweep of sky-scraping cliff…But I alone anchored my black ship outside.” This explicitly explains that he cares more about himself than the life of his crew members. Odysseus orders his crew members to go out and explore the island, neglecting the thought that they may never come back alive to see their loved ones back in Ithaca. Odysseus himself went through hardship suffering from nostalgia. But he still chooses to send his crew members out to explore these islands disregarding what they might face. Some might argue that Odysseus has done that for a reason. He might have done it to go back to his homeland to secure and to ensure peace and safety for the rest of the Archeans in Ithaca. However over 300 innocent men died in pain when they stopped at the Laestrygonian Island, and only the people in his ship survived unharmed, as shown in page 234. This is not a quality of a good king, he shouldn’t allow his own innocent people to die because of his own orders. This proves that Odysseus is very selfish and cares only about himself and to get back to his homeland safely.
ReplyDelete-Pinn Chirathivat
As already mentioned, Odysseus is a very complex character who we seem to keep peeling more and more layers off. As Ana said Odysseus was a great hero/leader in the Trojan War, but we find out there is much more to him. In Book Ten, line 104 "But I alone anchored my black ship outside, well clear of the harbor's jaws I tied her fast to a cliff side cable.", here Odysseus is separating his ship from the others. I feel as though we must give credit to Odysseus for looking out for himself but at the same time, he was not looking out for his crew. He was only looking out himself, he could have cared for his crew and saved many of their lives but he wasn't a great leader at all like he was made out to be, and actually was during the Trojan war. Also on line 222 (page 236) we see Odysseus do something similar, yet again that makes him look slightly cowardly "And so, Number of my band of men-at-arms into two platoons, I signed them each a leader: I took one and lore Eurychus the other. We quickly shoot lots in a bronze helmet— the lot of brave Eurylochus leapt out first." Odysseus is supposed to be the brave one but is sitting back staying in the boat while he lets others go and do the dangerous work. He could have easily saved many men in both of the situations, if he cared about them, and thought of a plan that would suit all of them, but he was too focused on his well being, which doesn't make him a very "God like man", that we were expecting.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus' character is pretty ambiguous when describing his personality. He is not completely horrible but isn't completely good either. I believe that his personality is alters depending in what circumstance he may be in. For example, when taking part in the Trojan war, he was seen as heroic and selfless. On the contrary, through his entire journey he displays a character that is selfish and backstabbing to his crew of men. He had to consideration for his crew and led them to their death beds on several occasions. Through out his journey he stops at the Cyclopes Island, to Aeaea, and later to the land of Laestrygonians. Whilst he was at these place she showed his true colors and the measures he was willing to go to just to save himself. This was proven on one instance when he was at the Island of Polyphemus. Odysseus basically gives permission for several of his men to die, on his behalf. Despite his attempt at getting revenge by blinding Polyphemus, he still proceeds to let men die, and escapes the island. Later on, when he was returning to Aeaea looking for a place to stay in, he has the audacity to the blame his crew as the reason their journey wasn’t successful. In line 74 calls his crew men “mutinous” and takes no fault for the failure of their journey even though he should have his men under control. Not to mention, Odysseus planned a way to escape -without even considering his crew- after he realized that the Laestrygonians were trying to kill everyone of his men including him. His plan was to leave his ship at the outermost part of the port so that in any instant he could away before everyone else. This meant that practically led his men to their grave without any regard to the safety of his men. From lines 140-144 he describes having to leave his crew as meal for these people. This revealed the truest colors of Odysseus. His modus operandi was “every man for himself”.
ReplyDeleteI agree with both Anna and Sarah that Odysseus definitely has many different layers to his moral code. His train of thought towards his own personality is also complex. For example, Odysseus had a foreboding feeling when he and his men docked at the Laestrygonian island; on page 233, he takes extra care to dock his own ship outside of the port, without telling the other men: “But I alone anchored my black ship outside, well clear of the harbor’s jaws I tied her fast to a cliff side with a cable.” This results in the mass slaughter of over 90% of his men (11 out of 12 ships) when the Laestrygonian giants throw rocks down at the ships, which were like sitting ducks with no room to row the boats out and no wind to sail them (page 233: “…right into the gaping cove and moored tightly, prow by prow. Never a swell there, big or small; a milk-white calm spreads all around the place). Although Odysseus made such a selfish decision as to not inform his men of his suspicion, thus getting the majority of them killed, he still feels sad about it; on page 234, he says, “From there we sailed on, glad to escape our death yet sick at heart for the dear companions we had lost.” He does not even mention remorse over not telling them his doubts, or that he thinks it is his fault, he just says that he feels bad that they died.
ReplyDeleteHe also seems at least a bit emotionless towards his remaining men as he scouts the Aeaean island, where Circe lived; he was considering physically scouting out the island on his own first, but then reconsidered to send his men to do the job instead. On page 235, Odysseus remarks, “Mulling it over, I thought I’d scout the ground – that fire aglow in the smoke, I saw it, true, but soon enough this seemed the better plan: I’d go back to the shore and the swift ship first, feed the men, then send them out for scouting.” This makes it seem like he values his own life far higher than his subordinates, which is expected, but still sounds a bit selfish.
However, Odysseus isn’t completely a terrible person; it was shown that he was willing to save his men from Circe, even though he didn’t even know what had happened to them, only that they had disappeared into the goddess’s palace. When Eurylochus returns to tell of the fate of the scouts who explored Circe’s island, he says, “Don’t force me back there, captain, king – leave me here on the spot. You will never return yourself, I swear, you’ll never bring back a single man alive. Quick, cut and run with the rest of us here – we can still escape the fatal day!” Essentially, Eurylochus is entirely willing to abandon the rest of the men out of fear of sharing their fate, whatever it may be. However, to this Odysseus replies, “Eurylochus, stay right here, eating, drinking, safe by the black ship. I must be off. Necessity drives me on.” This emphasizes Odysseus’s desire to save his crew – in contrast to how he decided not to reveal his suspicions to his men on the Laestrygonian island, this time he makes it seem he cares a little more about his crew. Even when Odysseus is met by Hermes in the woods on the way to the palace, who tells him that Circe might “unman” him, and “strip away his courage” while he lies in bed with her, Odysseus still decides to go save his men, which is pretty brave considering what is at stake. Overall, Odysseus is certainly a many-sided character with different aspects of his personality that are admirable and not that admirable, which is shown clearly through his visit to the Laestrygonian island and Circe’s island.
I totally agree when Odysseus makes his crew scout instead of him, it does make him seem kind of selfish. This is was a good point that was not really brought up. I now remember reading it and think what a jerk Odysseus was acting like.
DeleteThe place that reveals the most alarming aspect of Odysseus’ character would have to be the Laestrygonian Island. Odysseus and his crew sail into a windless natural port, it’s fashioned in such a way that it would be incredibly difficult to turn around and flee should the situation call for it. So, Odysseus parks all of his other ships inside of the port while leaving his own right outside for a quick escape. He doesn’t attempt to find another place for his crew to dock or decide that whatever his crew does he must also do, he just quietly slinks away to anchor his boat out of danger, “…I alone anchored my black ship outside, well clear of the harbor’s jaws”. (Page 233, line 104-105) Throughout what we’ve read so far, Odysseus has been portrayed as a crafty and cunning man, capable of (as both Anna and Sarah said) deciphering a situation’s subtext and distilling his best possible actions for the most favorable outcome. Despite this intelligence, Odysseus doesn’t seem particularly concerned with letting his crew (and brothers in arms, describing Eurylochus as “…close as kin…” (Page 244, line 486)) wander headfirst into any danger he might have foreseen. He uses them as bait for whatever big-scary is hiding around the next bend. Further evidence of his coldhearted and calculated nature is evident in how he doesn’t seem particularly pertubed by the fact that he just lost six sevenths of his entire crew. Chapter ten has left me with questions as to what his men see in him when it’s clear that they’re being picked off faster than sorority girls in a slasher film. I know that if I were on that ship, I would have mutinied by at least the island with the giant cannibals. So what’s keeping Odysseus’ men from jumping ship as well? Eurylochus puts it perfectly: “just as the Cyclops trapped our comrades in his lair with hotheaded Odysseus right beside them all—thanks to this man’s rashness they died too!” (Page 244, line 480-483) if Eurylochus is thinking it, Odysseus’ very own brother-in-arms, surely, others must also be starting to realize that come the next island… they might be next.
ReplyDelete-Eilidh Dunsmore
Odysseus's character is very complex, as stated by everyone else. I agree that a very clear example of part of his character is on the island of the Laestrygonians. This was displayed when Odysseus said that he "alone anchored my black ship outside, well clear of the harbor's jaws I tied her fast to a cliff side cable." By doing this, he is showing a great concern for himself, while barely thinking of his crew, of whom he is responsible. Odysseus has been displayed as being clever, and this action is an example of this, but it definitely shows his weakness as a leader. This action is also quite heartless, and is basically him leaving his crew to die. Overall, I thought this was a very defining moment for Odysseus, and it lowered my opinion of him.
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ReplyDeleteAs everyone has been saying, I think that like most characters in the Odyssey, Odysseus has more than one layers and is very intricate. When he and his ships come to the island of the Laestrygonians, in pages 233 and 234, he knows there is the possibility of trouble so he plans to save himself by isolating his ship from the other 11 that are squeezed in the trap that is known as the port. "But I alone anchored my black ship outside, well clear of the harbor's jaws" (line 104). When the natives start to devour his men, he hightails out of their, only caring about his well being. "And what a joy as we darted out toward open sea, clear of those beetling cliffs...my ship alone, but the rest went down en masse. Our squadron sank. (Line 143) piggybacking off of what Sarah said, he lost a LOT of men. He knew there was a high likelihood of danger, but chose not to tell the others. If he did, was it possible, if they were all out of the harbor, that Odysseus could've been in one of the ships to go down. It is obvious that he is very strategic and probably thought ahead and thought of many different scenarios. Odysseus shows a different "layer" of himself when his men are captured by Circe. On page 242, Odysseus doesn't know if he can trust Hermes. There was a huge possibility that the herb had no powers and like Sarah and others stated, could have resulted in him forced under Circe's spell as well. Odysseus doesn't think about this possibility because he does everything Hermes tells him to do clearing assuming Hermes was truthful. "She struck with her wand... Off to your sty, you swine..."(line 355) This was a huge risk and even though Odysseus agrees to take the longer route home afterwards, he and men may have never left that island. He proved to be courageous and selfless when he did this. When Eurylochus told him the likely consequences of him going to the palace, he went anyway. Is it because he was ignorant? Nonetheless, he risked his life, in a way, for his men. But I still have mixed feelings about him because at the previous island he seemed to only care about himself. He is very complex...(strokes chin)
ReplyDelete-Sam Kaplan
With each chapter we learn more and more about Odysseus. Some stories that we hear about him are quite positive and live up to the God like reputation that he has been given. And some seem to show parts of him that don't seem so admirable. As has been discussed in detail above, the example of Odysseus docking outsider of the cove and not letting anyone else know that he had a bad feeling about all being crammed into one spot. This example shows both his smarts, and his deceptiveness. He may have purposefully chosen not to tell anyone about docking outside of the cove incase there had been some kind of emergency and he needed to get away. Because if all of the ships were outside the cove then it may have been more of a risk of him not being able to get away. Whereas because all the other ships are packed in the cove the Laestrygonians don't try to stop his ship because they are focused on the other eleven ship. We also see that Odysseus is very brave, maybe too brave. In the second half of chapter ten when he is going to go to Udhvhjd palace, if Hermes hadn't come to save him he would have been turned into an animal. So he had the bravery to try to find his men, but he got lucky that Hermes was willing to help him out. Another point that caught my attention was on page 245 " Captain this is madness! High time you thought of your own home at last, if it really is your fate to make it back alive... 'Their urging brought my stubborn spirit round." So basically after a year of being at a goddess's palace he doesn't seem to be in a rush to get home at all. His comrades are actually the ones to get him to think about home, without them who knows how long it would be before he got bored with Circe's.
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ReplyDeleteI agree to what Sarah said, Odysseus's character grows more and more complex as the epic reveals itself. Our expectations of Odysseus were always very high because of the descriptions the gods and people about Odysseus. Our standards for Odysseus are very high, but in book 10, it is revealed that Odysseus is greedy and disloyal to his crew. Odysseus shows some inteligence when he "alone anchored my black ship outside, well clear of the harbor’s jaws." We see Odysseus's unfaithfulness to his crew when they go to the Laestrygonian land. Odysseus achored his ship outside the harbor that was "close around the mouth so the passage was cramped." (pg 233).Odysseus anchored his ship there so he didn't need to manuever his ship through the crowded harbor and escape easily. When the Laestrygonians attack Odysseus and his men, Odysseus runs away as quickly as leaving 11 out of 12 boats and his men to die. Odysseus has been with these men for 11 years now. However, I don't think it's completely wrong that Odysseus is disloyal to his crew after the crew let the bag of wind blow in the opposite direction. You could see how Odysseus was angry, right when he could the shore of his country, his own crew had blew them off corse. No god cursed them, it was purely the crews fault. He was "sick at heart for the dear companions we had lost" on page 234. As Robert said, we see the return of Odysseus's courage when he is on the Aeaen Island. At the end of the chapter, Odysseus risks returning to Ithaca many years later, in order to safe his crew. Odysseus is not a one dimensional character, he is complex, intelligent, arrogant at times, courageous, and greedy like all humans.
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ReplyDeleteWhen they visit the land of laestrygonians, I noticed that he harbored the ship by itself, and not with his other men. He wanted to have a better chance at getting away if there was danger. It was a clever idea, but this shows how selfish Odysseus can be. He left all his men to die, while he escaped with only a ship worth of men. His character is not that heroic, because when it gets risky, he does whatever it takes for himself to be fine, but doesn't really care for others.
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